Last minute injunction won!

Press Statement in response to court injunction against Dale Farm forced eviction.

Dale Farm resident, Kathleen McCarthy said, “We still need somewhere to go, if we have to leave here. Today is a great victory, but we still need Basildon Council to approve a legal site for us.”

Ends.

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102 Responses to Last minute injunction won!

  1. I guess that all those who feel that the Dale Farm residents should be able to build what they want on land because they own it – regardless of the planning laws – will be fully behind the current Government proposals to relax planning laws, which many organisations, such as the National Trust and Campaign for the Protection of Rural England, fear will lead to developers getting a freer hand to develop – regardless of local opinion.

    If you win the fight at Dale Farm I expect you will all to rush over to Newmarket and defend the right of Edward Stanley, the Earl of Derby, who inherited 160-acre Hatchfield Farm, on the edge of Newmarket to build 1,200 houses on the greenfield site and advise him to simply ignore the planning process and the voices of protest from local residents because it is his land and he should have the right to do what he wants with it.

    You can’t have one rule for one section of the community and another of a different section – and knowing how fair, even-handed and anti-discriminatory you all are I am sure you understand the principles at stake here.

    Yeah – right!

  2. Simon says:

    OK here goes, my attempt to understand, because like many member s of the ‘settled community’ I don’t profess to understand Traveller culture. However it seems to me that the issue is what constitutes a Traveller. In the eyes of the settled, this probably means someone that travels and is not living in a fixed location, as that is logical. From what I’ve seen in the media recently, the Travellers consider themselves as an ethic group and the fact that they are on the move, or settled in one location is irrelevant.

    I have no problem with people living an alternative travelling lifestyle, but, big but, that does not give anyone the right to flout the law of the land. So if Travellers are mobile, they should live on legal sites and not occupy land owned by others. If Travellers are not moving around and are in fact settled, then their lives and homes should be subject to the same laws as everyone else and that includes complying with planning regulations.

    Unfortunately Travellers have a bad reputation and many settled people are scared and worried by them. They have a reputation for dirtiness, untidiness and dishonesty. I’m certain this isn’t something that applies to all Travellers, but equally it does apply to some. I recently cycled along the Flitch Way near Great Dunmow. It’s a lovely country area, but after a while I came across rubbish strewn around and guess what, it was next to a Travellers site. There was no need for it, nobody had been moved off the site in a hurry and there were rubbish bins available, it was simply the way that the people living there chose to behave.

    It seems to me that the Travelling community have a major part to play if they want to be better respected by the rest of society. Surely in order to eradicate any undeserved opinions about them, this community needs to demonstrate that while ‘alternative’, they can behave in a way that won’t alienate others. I also think that some of the recent comments by the Travellers have been unhelpful; whatever crimes may have been committed against Gypsies in the past, nobody today is behaving like they are in Nazi Germany and sending people to the gas ovens.

    • canuck22 says:

      Can someone clear up this issue for me? Is this that the people living on this land, and are legal owners of the property, are disregarding the planning regulations? Or is it that they are illegally preventing the legal authorities from obtaining access to the land? Or is it that these people are wrongfully classified as Travellers, because they are of a fixed address and therefore no longer legally able to avoid proterty taxes etc? Or is it in fact, that the governement truly just doesn’t like them as a group and are guilty of an attempt to ‘ethnically cleanse’ the area? Can someone help me here?

  3. Jemma says:

    From what I believe it IS a legal site, they OWN the land and whether some of it be green belt or not, apparently the council had concreted it before they first took up residence there anyway, and repeatedly dumped waste there! So who are they to say to the travellers to remove their dwellings when they obviously didnt care about the ‘rules’ while they were breaking them themselves?? I believe, also, that this has come at a time where the government are planning to change planning applications for green belt land allowing more housing to be built on it, if you do some research you will find petitions against it everywhere online to ‘save the countryside’ against this change in law. It really is a pointless waste of time trying to make a point of these travellers. Give them a break, they and their children face enough bigoted and unfounded criticism already, question the local authority not the people.

  4. Jemma says:

    I am sickened by this thread, have you all forgotten the point of this discussion? 90 percent of what I have read is self important squabbling. None of you have the right to degrade each other and pass judgement on fellow human beings in the way which you are doing, shame on every one of you, you know who you are. The point at hand is that a hundred families (with children) are being forced out of their lives (and in the childrens cases, WORLDS) by a power which none of us can control. In my opinion there is nothing, no cost that would justify doing this to any families. The foul language and pathetic sniping from some of you just goes to show what a lifetime of dumbing down and conforming has done to you and your judgement. Yes, law has been broken, but with respect and compromise (which I know that the travellers are open to) every problem can be resolved. We are all human beings, we are diverse, we should respect each others differences peacefully. We were all kids once who shared and laughed in the sun, maybe we could learn a thing or two by reflecting on this. You have my full support this weekend and the support of many others around me.

    • Fred says:

      The only people that brought this situation of eviction into place are the families that took up residence on a site they knew to be illegal.

      If they had chosen to pass Dale Farm by and take up residence on a legal site, none of this would ever have happened. They would have lived in peace, and never been worried about this day of eviction arriving.

      It is the travellers who did this to themselves. They know this, we know this, everyone knows this – but its only the travellers and their ridiculous supporters that refuse to accept it.

      The council, government, or local residents didnt do this to the travellers. They did it to themselves.

    • You are right some of the comments on this thread are unfortunate but, while this is no excuse, people are simply exasperated by what they see as one section of the community flouting the law in a way that they wouldn’t get away with. The community at large decides on planning policy and the rules around it through our elected members. Indeed the government is currently reviewing planning policy – so why not campaign for the changes you would like to see that would let anyone who owns land build what they want on it without permission. I am sure that travellers would be happy with this …. as would developers and land owners. You would find that this wouldn’t be supported by a large number of environmental groups and organisations like the National Trust and I suspect people living in rural communities that don’t ant their chosen way of life adversely affected by unwanted development.

      No one is being evicted from Dale Farm – or ethnically cleansed. After ten years of legal wrangling the Council may – subject to a further court hearing on Friday – be able to remove structures from the site that have been built without proper planning approval. If this includes dwellings then the occupiers have been offered alternative accommodation.

      The irony of all this is that Basildon Council has one of the better records of providing sites for travellers. Many other Council’s are doing a lot less for this section of the community. Why aren’t you campaigning ion local areas where residents are constantly opposing the development of new sites for travellers or ensuring that the targets for the provision of sites is made mandatory on Councils – rather than what seems to be happening at the moment and that is that rules will be relaxed even further, making life even more difficult for the travelling community.

  5. Zoey says:

    LOOL…..you tell em!

  6. Jim says:

    Solidarity from Germany! Hope you will win your struggle!

  7. Fred says:

    I know we would never find out, but I really do hope he or his family read this and take legal action against the owners of this site or indeed yourself personally for that post.

  8. Paul Griffiths says:

    “Dale Farm resident, Kathleen McCarthy said, “We still need somewhere to go, if we have to leave here. Today is a great victory, but we still need Basildon Council to approve a legal site for us.”” So says the story at the top of the page. I would ask a few questions here:

    1. are the ‘residents’ of Dale Farm ‘residents’ or ‘travellers’? If they are travellers why can’t they have their base in Ireland where clearly many, if not all, of them originate and simply ‘travel’ in the UK in the Summer months?

    2. A lot of comments have been made that those who feel that the Dale Farm residents should comply with the law are making racist comments – but are the ‘residents’ of Dale Farm Gypsies – which is a recognised ethnic group?

    3. If any other resident built a structure without planning consent they would have to take it down or it would be taken down for them. This happens up and down the country every day of the week. Why are the ‘residents’ of Dale Farm any different. Are they above the law? If you don’t like a particular law campaign to have it changed. You can’t just pick and choose.

    4. The campaign for Dale Farm has run a very effective and highly emotional PR campaign and should be congratulated for that. All the pictures are of old women and young children – where are the other family members? They say that if they have to move from Dale Farm they would have nowhere to go. This is simply not true. Basildon Council has offered all families alternative Council housing.

    5. Also, no one is being ‘evicted’ or ‘cleansed’ – again good emotive PR. What is happening is that structures that have been built without appropriate planning consent are being removed. As I understand it most of the plots on the legal part of the site remain unoccupied – why is this?

    6. There is a saying that ‘justice delayed is justice denied’. in this case the justice being denied is for the majority of population who want to see the planning laws upheld and enforced.

    • TAGilbert says:

      Gypsies and Irish Travellers have been recognised by the courts to be two
      distinct ethnic groups, so have the full protection of the Race Relations
      Act. The courts have made clear that travelling is not a defining characteristic of these groups, but only one among others. This is
      significant, because the majority of Britain’s estimated 300,000 Gypsies
      and Travellers are thought to live in conventional housing, some by
      choice, some because of the severe shortage of Gypsy sites.The estimated 90,000–120,000 living in caravans travel to varying
      degrees; a small number are highly mobile, some travel only during the
      summer months and some travel little or not at all, but still want to live in
      a caravan, surrounded by their extended family. The shortage of
      authorised residential and transit sites means that many, including those
      who would prefer long-term residential accommodation, camp
      unlawfully, leading to regular ‘enforced’ nomadism through constant
      evictions. For those who do not travel, travelling is more a ‘state of mind’
      than a day-to-day reality. The courts have ruled that nomadism and living
      in a caravan is a reflection of Gypsies’ and Irish Travellers’ cultural
      heritage, and not simply a lifestyle choice that can be ignored.

  9. chris's nan says:

    chris you do not know that it was gypsies who stole the things do you? Stop slandering a whole set of people because of the actions of a few,do you live in a house chris? So did gary glitter,the yorkshire ripper and ian huntley…so does that mean you are like them as well? You racist

    • Mags says:

      It is interesting that the ‘travellers’ claim ignorance of the law when it comes to planning permission, but have the savey to bring a court injunction. Also, how can they call themselves travellers when most of them have not moved for ten years.

  10. Pingback: Dale Farm victory. Racist eviction halted « The Free

  11. Alfie says:

    Some new law that’s just come in?

    • Kate says:

      this is Kate I spoke to Kathleen a few years ago on the phone I have found a website check it out theres a law on there who know it may help good luck God Bless ye all and love loads and I have told all my mates about you here it is
      http://www.justanswer.com/uk-law/1de6e-long-use-diused-land-becomes-prop.html

      • Paul Griffiths says:

        I don’t think that the law of Adverse Possession applies in this case. No one is contesting who owns the land. What is being contested at Dale Farm is the right to simply build what you want on land you own without appropriate planning approval. The land at Dale Farm, adjacent to the legal site, is greenbelt land and is subject to stricter rules than land that is zoned for development. This land can be used for the grazing of animals and similar activity but there are strict rule against development.. I presume, if you support the Dale Farm residents right to build without consent I guess – on the same principle – you would have no problem with Edward Stanley, the Earl of Derby, who inherited 160-acre Hatchfield Farm, on the edge of Newmarket and wants to build 1,200 houses on the greenfield site just going ahead and ignoring the planning / enquiry process he is following? I think not!!

  12. natural mystic says:

    some really dumbed down comments on here from some dumbed down idiots.
    The disgusting language being used to put the travellers down is disturbing and really not helpful,you can dress up your hatred how you wish but you will still be a bigot no matter how eloquently you present your argument,i ask all the traveller haters this…
    Would you rather have travellers or politicians as your neighbours? I assure you this,your standard of living would be far greater with travellers as your neighbours as the politicians would be happy for you to reside in utter poverty while the travellers have more of a heart and wouldnt see you hungry.
    This whole argument shows how the clever rich man can turn the poor man and woman against their neighbours using a tactic perfected in the control and bondage of black africans,the tactic is called divide and conquer.

  13. alice says:

    I have come to the conclusion that both alfie and kevin are in someway gutted that the former cornal guidalfi is on the run, bin laden is dead, sadam got beheaded and hitler chickened out with a cyanide pill. And that neither of you approve of barak obama! I bet u proper hated thatcher and are devastated that women can join the sas. Never mind there is enty of like minded people just like u in the world. But as the person said earlier, karma will come. And I like the travellers can sayhold my head high and be a proud non racist non fashist who likes to get the big picture. Yes they have broken planning laws but they do not deserve your foulness.

  14. Alfie says:

    Are you from the 1960s then?

    • alice says:

      Alfie. I am certainly not from the 1960’s I was born in 72, lived thru all the strikes of the 70’s an 80’s when believe it or not thousands of miners striked and kicked off far worse than the travellers have. Let alone all the ladies who protested against some nuclear deal. And no I was not involved (I was a kid)t but I can tell u that them miners went balistic. And I was raised by torie parents! And b4 u start no I don’t vote green nor wear a kaftan. What I do though is listen to others opinions and show respect. Oh and did I say I even have pals from all ages, races and religions I even have friends who are not very bright.

      • Alfie says:

        ‘Protested against some nuclear deal’. Wow, you certainly have your finger on the pulse. I remember the miners strike clearly. Arthur Scargill thinking he can take on the government when the country had millions of tons of coal stockpiled and even if it hadn’t, we could have imported it at much lower cost than digging it out of the ground. Where did that get the miners? Ask one who is still unemployed even now. I’m sure he’d be delighted to tell you.

  15. Alfie says:

    If I have bought it, how is it stolen and who have I stolen it from?

  16. Alfie says:

    If I’ve bought it, how have I stolen it and who have I stolen it from? Are you a student?

    • Emma says:

      Is it my correct spelling that gives me away? No, I’m not. Let’s start from the beginning… How did you earn the money to ‘buy’ it?

      • Alfie says:

        Well it wasn’t by stealing pensions from old ladies.I work for it. Or is working for a living non PC now? Are you going to give me some convoluted reason why working for a living is theft? Ah, perhaps we should all live in a commune, living off the land. Good luck with that. I’ll stick with working for a multinational that payed (cash) for my 911 as a result of my hard work. No one cares what you think, or what I think. Deal with it.

  17. alice says:

    They do pay council tax alfi, and car tax oh and car insurance too! And I too like u am an all paid up non traveller and no they don’t like to mix with us as they get direct and indirect racism day in day out, just like blacks did in the usa. Do u ever remember signs up at pubs stating no travellers, that didn’t end till late 90’s. Just think why they don’t mix with us!

    • Alfie says:

      Really, like the drunk ‘traveller’ on Road Wars in a BMW X5 which was registered to a non existent address in the North of England, driven at high speed into the back of an MGF whereuopn the traveeler driver ran off and hid, only to be captured by police helicopter. Thankfully, the court banged him up. He was law abiding alright……………

    • Fred says:

      How exactly do you have a car insured correctly without a registered address? Answer. As per Alfies example, the car is registered to a false address.

      How exactly do homes which have been built without planning permission pay council tax? They are not registered as homes, so cannot be subject to the taxes (which is why they are “travellers” in the first place.

      Do you ever think why people put up signs saying “no travellers” in the first place?

      I see they are incapable of following simple planning laws or choose to ignore them, but when they do live on a legal site, they manage full well to navigate the benefits system without fail. And you accuse the authorities of double standards! lol.

  18. Erin says:

    I am personally in two minds. Yes it is wrong what the people of dale farm have done, it’s not fair that they have built on land that wasn’t theirs! How is that fair? However, the cost to move them and the trouble that it will cause, is it worth it? I think if there were to be more land taken up then they should absolutely go! But otherwise just leave them and spend the money on something else! The majority of our own country is living in poverty, services such as sure starts are being closed due to lack of funds! That is where the money should go!

  19. Cheerio! says:

    Why are travellers called travellers if they are so against travelling?

  20. Paul says:

    Freddy, your Ignorence and stupidity has no bounds, you say these people are claiming benefits and are a drain on the system, then claim they have no NI number, well you can not claim benefits without an NI number, you claim a percentage of your tax is deducted for as you put it ( drains on society) how much Freddy?
    Because I know the figure its going to cost the Tax payer to evict them, as for the legal sites around the country there are not enough to house one 5th of the travelling community,and as for the number of Travellers in the prison system is less then 1.5 percent.
    As for pissing off back to their home land some of these people are from N Ireland which I will inform you is a so called part of theUnited Kingdom so infact what home land are you refering too?

    Codge, You really are joking right, East London and I quote, We all get along fairly well, because we all agree to play by the same rules, LMFAO what rules are they the gang shooting rules or the rioting rules, where shops were burned and looted and people made homeless, how`s the new lap top?.

    Kevin, OK you mastered cut and paste, very good tomorrow you will be allowed out.

    • Michelle says:

      Wow…. well said!!!! Couldn’t agree more!

      • Cheerio! says:

        Whoever is running this blog is massively censoring the comments – this is pathetic.

        Out with the travellers!

    • Alfie says:

      I wasn’t aware that having an opinion was on a par with looting shops and destroying livelihoods. We still live in a democracy love.

    • Fred says:

      Housing benefit requires one claimant per household, multiple households can have one named party. Not all people residing within the household have to be registered in order to secure the benefit. So before you try and look clever, please feel free to educate yourself on how the system works. My personal tax bill last year was into six figures, so I believe I have a right to stand up for how I believe it should be spent (or not be spent in this case).

      Its quite easy to find enough vacant plots using simple online searches of the county or local councils, but of course that requires them to put some effort in. It is of course much easier to pitch up wherever they choose and then play the victim when told to move on.

      As for being from Northern Ireland – you know this as fact do you? Please tell me where I can read such facts. In the meanwhile, perhaps you could review the location of Rathkeale, the original location of many of the “applicants”, and location of some of the applicant’s actual homes. Now unless my Atlas is out of date, that is certainly not part of Northern Ireland.

      Then we get to the prison statistics you mention. Let us assume your figure of 1.5% of prisoners being “travellers” is correct. As they only account for 0.5% of the UK population, then by your very figures they are committing three times more offences than their population percentage would dictate. You actually want to use this figure as a defence?

    • johnnyham1 says:

      Codge, re the rules being simple, the ‘law of the land’, the law of the land is on their side, it’s the law of the sea that they are violating. Take a look at the differences, it is my belief that to adhere to the law of the land you do not require planning permissions. And they are building on land, their own land i believe. Which is.. not on the sea.
      It isn’t simple, i was born in the ’60’s never thought law at school, or anywhere else. I know right from wrong, but this was thought by my parents, etc. I think it would be fair to say there exists far too many people that know nothing of law. If this was not the case why does everyone need a solicitor? Or why do we all need a solicitor to interpret law for us?
      There is a solution for these problems, that does not require bulldozers or hiding from the problem. I don’t have the solution but i know it exists. That is a certainty, will it be found in time, hmmmm, everyone involved need to honesty look together, with a common goal of win / win. Not sure.

  21. Debra says:

    Please can all the racists go away! I am not a traveller and yes I do pay my taxes, etc,.etc… I am a single, working mother and i believe in live and let live, come on people! treat others how you would wish to be treated yourselves! stop arguing about who gets what and just get on with your lives, leaving others to live theirs! traveller, migrant worker, dole sponging twat or asylum seeker! get a grip! what is happening at dale farm is needless and wrong, we should be uniting in the present climate not causing yet more wars
    x

    • alice says:

      Well done all who understand the bigger picture. Those who are swearing and breaching the communications act should have a look and see which section they r breaking when they are pubically racist and use foul language! And thabks to those of you who understand the enormity of the real issues, thank god. I thought for a while that I was on a bnp or kkk website.

      • Alfie says:

        Don’t worry. It’s not BNP or KKK. Just people who have an opinion that doesn’t fit with the wet, liberal, sycophantic, do-gooder rhetoric you would like to hear.

      • Lee says:

        I wouldn’t worry allice the swearing indicates ignorance these people need our sympathy maybe a website could be set up to help these unfortunates

      • Alfie says:

        Bury your head in the sand all you wish.

    • Emma says:

      I don’t know how you’d be able to see any shit on the ground: I imagine most of your time is taken up by verbally excreting a large amount on forums.

    • Alfie says:

      Emma, sorry my opinions don’t meet with your wet, do-gooder approval. The tide, however, is turning rapidly.

    • Debra says:

      Your opening comment says it all! why call someone a name that is obviously an insult? have we not moved on from this kind of language and abuse?. I’ve had my home broken into twice, once while me and my son were at home sleeping. It was a local resident, do i now hate every local person?! No!, there are bad apples in every barrel, i just think people should integrate and communicate and maybe try to get on? I have only visited this site the once, am neither anti or for what is happening so wouldn’t like any abuse please. I just think it is a shame that it has come to this. I hope that it can be resolved peacefully.

    • Alfie says:

      Debra. Wouldn’t it be great if everyone wanted to get along? Travellers choose to exclude themselves from mainstream society and contravene the laws that this country has been built upon. Wouldn’t it be great to sell up, buy a caravan and then ask the council to find me somehwere to pitch up, provide sanitation and all of the other things that I currently have to pay for as a ‘member of the settled community’. Only problem is, if everyone did it, the country woulkd descend into chaos in weeks. Get real.

    • Fred says:

      Yes – treat others how we expect to be treated.

      If I build a house on land I own, without planning permission, I expect to be told to remove it. If I dont, I expect to have it removed for me.

      But of course when it comes to travellers, then they expect different treatment.

      If you preach treating others how we expect to be treated, what is so wrong with the eviction?

      It seems fairly simple to me. Homes built without permission, homes taken down. Simple, nothing complex, its just that when this happens to a minority, its racist nazi behaviour. When it happens to a man building a castle in his own field, then its perfectly fine… You do make me laugh.

  22. Lee says:

    And father jack do you actualy know what pikey means? obviously not I would say educate yourself but your choice of words indicates this would be a task

    • alice says:

      Father jack has taken his manners too far. Use your technology sonny jack and look up communications act 2003 offences. Then get off line, grow some and take a long hard look in a mirror. If u like what u see then carry on being a rude boi and see where it gets ya! A trip up a sad, hostile, full of hate life. And I am NO liberal but a realist with manners

  23. den says:

    Well done guys🙂 behind you all the way

  24. Lee says:

    Mmm lots of hiltler youth members in this thread travellers are hard working people they don’t claim benefits and stay in groups like Dale farm for safety I do lots of work for travellers mot testing and repairing vehicles I never have any worries about not being paid as often happens with so called normal people in houses they are secretive because of the way they are treated like all of us they want a quiet life and to be aloud to live as they want if you want an idea of how it feels take a drive as I often do in a travellers vehicle and see how people view and speak to you put yourself in their shoes and see how it makes you feel

  25. Alex says:

    This is a serious issue and I for one support the Dale Farm residents fully. What do they expect the travellers to do, move on?

  26. So you have won another week of grace then, congratulations for that.

    I just watched: “Gypsy Eviction: The Fight for Dale Farm” – http://www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches/episode-guide/series-101/episode-1

  27. Sue Fenton says:

    Kevin – you would appear to be lacking in imagination? Maybe you had a hard day and couldn’t think of anything else to write, but I feel that vitriolic spite is much more interesting when it’s intelligent.
    I don’t know a great deal about this situation but am I not right in thinking that the travellers own the land? There are plenty of cases of property owners not applying for planning permission for developments, or applying retrospectively; would the anti-traveller brigade be consistent in their arguments? For instance, in my area, Starbucks opened a new branch without having been granted planning permission for a change of use. Would you argue that in a case like that, the owners should have been turfed out? Or should there be a different set of rules for wealthy corporations?

    • alice says:

      Thank You to peter, billaricy boy and sue for understanding the level of compexity with the whole situation, which is how I thought it was just me who sees the bigger picture. Clearly my point about the mindless racist comments is about the level many are at! I really hope that the situation is resolved by the travellers at dale farm so they can hold their heads up high to show the world that they have the standards I know they have. And I know that travellers leave for work when many are asleep in the morn and return after a hard honest days work, then pay taxes. I have never been up to dale farm but have been to visit surrey sites but most travellers all have the same standards and work ethics. Thanks for speaking out and understanding. And as I said b4 I am not a traveller and so not biased but a realist!

  28. billericay boy says:

    freddy how interesting you seem to know precisely nothing of the history of dale farm, but you know the intricate financial position of all the residents. How is this, did you go over and interview them all? I certainly hope you’re not blowing off hot air based on your preconceived prejudices about travellers and that you have actually visited dale farm. What may shock you, is that this has not been some cunning plan to grab land, it was john major who told the families to buy dale farm in order to resolve the issues where they had been in several disputes over ownership of other land. Then they filed for permission and the lovely local MP launched a petition against them – hmmmm i wonder why that was? – so permission was denied, but again the govt saw the problem and on the legal half granted permission with john prescott giving a temporary reprieve on the current half in question. So at every juncture the families hat actually worked in good faith. And these are not legal experts, many are illiterate. Now i presume you have not been to dale farm, because if you had as i have, you would’ve seen all the vans and trucks returning in the evening from a day’s work like you would on any residential street. Additionally you would’ve known that many residents received help in filling out their council vc forms etc, so i’m bemused by your assertions. Anyway, tax evasion is a criminal matter, not a civili one as this is, nor is it grounds for eviction. I also wonder how all these supposed problems you sight would be dealt with on the other LEGAL half, seeing as you want planning law to be a catch all conduit for punishing a minority? they will remain, so perhaps you may get your chance to go see for yourself. And yes, i am a local resident, and i’m disgusted OUR council tax and OUR income tax is being used to destroy OUR community rather than build it. It seems economic contribution is high up your criteria for weather someone should be allowed the basic human right to a home without fear of persecution, yet no mention of the cost to apply this eviction? you can try to hide your bigotry behind your excuses but it is clear for all to see….

    • Fred says:

      I know full well the history of Dale Farm. from the days when it was granted license to be a scrap yard, sold and ultimately given permission for half the site to become a legal residential area for travellers back in the 70’s.

      The travellers then decided to use the other half as residential without permission, and ultimately here we are today. Anyone with access to half a brain cell and the ability to read will be able to find out the total number of benefit claims being issued to Dale Farm, and can cross refference this with the number of people now living there.

      You yourself say that these are not legal experts, and many are illiterate, yet seem perfectly happy withthem sending their children to the same schools as everyone else, just so the standards can be dragged down with them.

      You do like to twist things dont you. Anyone who abides by the laws and sets up home on a legal site has every right to live in their home without fear of persecution. These people do not live in legal homes, yet you seem adamant they should be given the same rights as everyone else.

      As you are a local, why not offer them space in your garden until they find somewhere legal to stay?

      Thought not.

  29. Peter Baker says:

    Do you realise that Oxford City Council have set presidents on planning by allow people to take public land without authorisation and put buildings on them.

    Ashurst Way , Rose Hill Oxford… Asian Family build house in back garden that encroaches on public land. Owner found to be importer of illegal imigrants and put in prison for his crimes ( mainly family members bought over claiming benefits and living in housing owned by him. This property was supposed to be dealt with by OCC but is still standing and people have now been moved into the property and if investigated are probably claiming benefits to live in an illegal house. This house is next to the Housing Office on the estate…….Man in Garsington Oxford has taken part of a footpath outside his house and put a brick wall on it and the hedgerow that is growing takes up almost all the pathway. This on the main throughroad in Garsington and Mothers have to go on the road if they have a large buggy to get past. Council does nothing.
    Point is that the council has allowed these things to happen and has given anyone the right to take public land without prior notice but your being evicted from land that you own. Court of human rights where are your standards.

    A friend named Peter.

  30. alice says:

    Would any of us that live in houses, change our lifestyles and live in a caravan, vardy, chalet? So why should we expect travellers to live in houses if they don’t want to! Where do you all think the fair ground or circus folk live when they are travelling? They don’t book up in a hotel and leave the expensive machinery to be pilfered by criminals, do you? I know they have broken planning laws. But so do many other general people, say for example those who bend the rules such as well knoiwn supermarkets who always state in planning applications that they will landscape an area where they want to open a new supermarket! Have some of you never noticed the new kids play area, fancy roundabout or green area created by the supermarkets that we all shop in! Despite what you all think the travellers may have crown derby and fancy stuff _ which they DO buy from shops _ but they are not millionaires ( most are not). Think it through guys they are not scum humans.

    • Freddy says:

      Here someone goes again comparing a travelling communities planning application for a permanenet residence to that of a company or individual that contributes to society in the form of jobs or local authority revenue..

      (leaving aside the irony of a “travelling” community applying for permission to build a permanent residence)

      Have you actually looked at the site? Have you seen the houses that have been built? These are certainly permanent structures.

      Yes there are parks and green areas built by large developers. They follow the laws, they also in various areas have a contribution to local art scheme. Im not sure the scaffold structure at the front of Dale Farm qualifies under this particular requirement, but I suppose they could ask.

      Travellers spend money in the shops and you think this is justification do you? Where exactly does this money come from? If they are of no fixed abode, they have no NI number. If they have no NI number, they pay no national insurance, they pay no income tax, but strangely can somehow muster up the energy required to register for housing benefit. Then they spend this in the shops, the shops then pay corporation tax, and the great circle of life that is the benefits system is complete.

      I suggest it is you that needs to think it through. Do you actually pay tax? Have you see how much is deducted from your wages each month to pay for drains on society such as this?

      • alice says:

        I do pay tax and I also pay into a public services pension, which has gone up, but not towards my pension pot but to make up the difference in the economy. But hey different discussion, so not relevent. And I have no idea which travellers have no NI code as when each human in the uk is born, wherever they are born be it barn,caravan, hospital or house by law we are all registered,eveb travellers have birth certs! Believe it or not! And it is that which generates your NI number. And I know that to be true as a civil servant explained it to me, ask about if u don’t believe me. How do u think the travellers get death certs when they die? They are not animals

      • Fred says:

        Its gone up to cover the massive gap between what needs to be paid out to civil servants and what is being put in. Its got absolutely Zero to do with the national debt, and just basic mathmateics that people are living longer and therefor taking more out of the pot than they have ever put in. But I see you prefer to believe the union leaflets that just ignore this basic principal.

  31. alice says:

    Dear freddie. My point is prooved. I suggest you go up to your nearest traveller site, a legal one or whatever you have near you and say that to their faces! Then go to handsworth and tell the asians (many who’s. Grandparents helped us in ww2) and tell them to go home! Then go into parts of london and say that to the black community! Face to face. I have never heard any traveller say such mindless twaddle. I know that there are criminals who happen to be travellers but I also know there are white, black, asian, other ethnic criminals. And when I worked in the court system the MAJORITY of criminals are white non travellers, and not because they don’t get caught but because most travellers don’t offend. Some do, I don’t live in a bubble. And for the record I am ful white english, non traveller but I DO live in the 21st century and DO have an open mind. Numb-skull.

    • alice says:

      Go look outside a job centre and see if any travellers go in to sigb on. Then you can justifibly say they are a drain on the countrys cash. And when you complete any form under ethnic origin, you often find ‘traveller/gypsy/romany’ as an option so it does seem to be considered to be a ethnic group. And as for your swearing it is rather futile. And yes I have looked at the ons And rowntree foundation statistics and yes travellers do break the law, but not every traveller in the whole of the uk, the percentage of them offending is not as high as u make out. it is all about respect really.

    • Freddy says:

      Feel free to take your head out of the sand long enough to google “travellers claiming housing benefit” and peruse the hundreds of thousands of results that are returned.

      Where did I state that traveller/gypsy/romany was not an ethnic minority? Is that YOUR racist chip on your shoulder starting to show again?

      Could you post the link to the ONS page which details the percentage of criminals in our prisons by ethnic group and how this relates to the percentage population of each ethnic group within the UK? Please go on, just so you can prove you arent passing off made up lines as fact….

      Why would a traveller sign on for jobseekers? Bit difficult without an NI number you idiot.

      The irony of you saying its all about respect when discussing an entire community that have given the planning laws zero respect is quite laughable. Or is respect a one way street for these people too?

  32. Amanda says:

    I can’t go and buy cheap land and build on it so why is it different for the residents of Dale farm. And if i hear one more time you have no where to go and what about the children and the old people i think i will scream ! You will not be thrown out onto the streets ,the council will rehouse you and your children can still go to school.This is the the 21st century not the dark ages !

    You all knew when you started building ,that it was against the law !
    You only have yourself to blame, so stop blaming others for the consequences you brought on yourself.

    Oh and to all the activists do us all a favour and go get a job !

    • Freddy says:

      Hear Hear.

      There are many legal sites around the country. Enough to house every single person facing eviction from Dale Farm.

      As above, you decided to make your home on an illegal section of a site, so you knew the risks. You now want to play the victim and bypass the laws of the land because you decided to make your home there.

      You, the travellers brought this upon yourselves. Its not the council, Labour, Condem or any other group or individual you want to call a nazi. Its YOU.

      YOU subjected your children to eviction and seeing their community ripped apart the moment you made the decision to build and live on a illegal site. Blame anyone else you like, scream from your scaffold defenses if it makes you feel better, but its YOU that brought this upon yourselves.

  33. Active Message says:

    Unless I’m reading it wrong the judge has said you have till Friday to remove the blockade and for the activists to leave the site to allow for a safe removal of the residents. So will you be starting this tomorrow?

    • alice says:

      To active message’s response. Maybe you got a spare part of your garden they can pitch up in? Maybe not! so where do you expect them to live?

      • Active Message says:

        What’s wrong with the empty site in Cambridge?

      • Codge says:

        To be honest, I would expect them to go back to their houses in Ireland. Beyond that, I don’t actually care where they go. Pewrhaps their ‘cousins’ or other clan members can put them up ?

      • Zoey says:

        How about Somalia or Libya, even Iran? But I’m willing to be they aren’t wanted there either.

  34. Tommo says:

    It’s okay for Bristol City Football Club to be given permission to build a new stadium on ‘green belt land’ approved by Bristol City Council. Seems like double standards here! Of course being wealthy & rich will get you everywhere green belt land or not! Why is the government not stepping in to stop the go ahead of a football stadium on green belt land?

    • Poo says:

      well said!

    • Emma says:

      Do you have any statistics for your ‘illiterate’ children (probably best to spell that one correctly), ‘increases in crime’ or ‘reducing house value’ assertions? Building a stadium will cost the tax-payer more than the pittance of benefits that people in this country receive.

      And considering that you judge literacy as a form of intelligence, I’m pretty sure I’ve just quashed your somewhat misguided argument.

    • Lee says:

      Or because the council gets a nice back hander from the football club ? Mps exspences spring to mind🙂

  35. alice says:

    ere here emma, and just in case any of u missed my post on the past thread. Especially as many of you are disgusting racists, who probably have no ethnic friends, and I include scots,welsh or irish pals, judging by some of the comments I have seen! My message is…I am not a traveller but I am disgusted at all of the racist comments that are on this comments base. Maybe some of you feel that the racism that went on in the 1960s usa when signs were up saying ‘no coloureds’ or ‘blacks sit here or blacks door entrance’ and it was a criminal and civil offence for black people to break those rules. Sadly the travellers do not trust outsiders, especially any law authorities. But statistics of aug 2011 riots show that few if any people from the travelling community were involved, in fact majority were disgusted by events. Yes they have broken planning laws, but where do we expect them to go! And u who said back to ireland should really think hard about your own roots and family history! Travellers have a real sense of community, yes their own community and the travellers way! I know for a fact that when one of their own breaks the law they do get dealt with the travellers way. And I have always given travellers respect if they deserve it, as some don’t! But I just ignore those ones and the elders deal with it! Believe me they do. I always get respect back from them. I live in surrey which has many travellers and their manners are better than most settled people. Oh… Many of them do pay tax and NI and very few of them are on benefits (pride) which is more than we can say about most. So to any ttravellers who read this…don’t let yourselves down and sink to the levels of ignorant or racist fools, but show the country that u do all have decent morals but the ignorants need to find u proper sites! And to all u racsists…don’t ever assume u know or understand travellers ways as u clearly do not. Just think about it as who would have ever thought in the 60′s that the usa would have a black president. Especially as the traveller kids I teach are so intelligent, hard working and some have high and honest career plans! And their parents support school policies and teachers decisions (more so than many house dwelling parents) Stand by it just takes one to make it into politics to make a change to the current shameful way travellers are portrayed. And yes I do know that some travellers are bad, but that is the same in all communities! Oh and the racist comments and abusive comments are criminal breaches under the communications act 2003. So carry on making them to prove what a bunch of hypocrits u are! Who ARE breaking the law, just like u say travellers do. Doh!

    • Freddy says:

      Where do we expect them to go? Hows about any one of th massive number of legals places around the country.. That does involve paying their way though.

      The have a real sense of community do they? Hows about not nicking stuff from it then? Even the sky nes generator had its fuel can nicked ffs.

      You accept they have broken planning laws, but cant see why they are wrong in staying there? Many of them took up residence at this camp AFTER they knew it was illegal. Driving past plenty of legal sites to get there. Yet you still support them.

      Very few are on benefits? Are you fucking deluded? There are more housing benefit claims going into Dale Farm than there are houses!

      They are a disgusting drain on society and its resources, and they cant follow the same laws as everyone else in the land, yet we are supposed to feel sorry for them when they fall foul of it. What a joke.

      If we all lived that way – exactly how do you think we would fund the schools and hospitals they use?

      No seriously, if we all lived the way of the travellers – who is paying for your doctor when you fall ill?

    • Emma says:

      Property is theft. It is ‘legal’ for the British government to build WMDs in south London and to sell arms to dictators across the world. It is illegal to live in a disused field if you haven’t got permission from the same government that arms dictators.

      How is British law either logical or moral? You should be a moral human being before a law-abiding citizen.

  36. Emma says:

    Shame on you, Kevin and Julie. The residents of Dale Farm are human; what are you? They are peaceful; what are you?

    Good news from Dale Farm today. A small victory of human rights over arbitrary bureaucracy. Keep up the resistance… and thank you to everyone who went down today – I wish I could have been there too.

    In solidarity,

    Emma

    • Poo says:

      Seeing as your so open to them why don’t you let them live on your doorstep. Its nothing to do with human rights. If you want to campaign for human rights go to some oppressive dictatorship and campaign. People like you have nothing to do with this issue, just let the law run its course.

      Oh, and they are certainly NOT peaceful.

      • Emma says:

        I would welcome travellers to live near me… it’s nice that not everyone is engulfed in mindless capitalism.

        Human rights refers to everyone being treated like human beings, which Basildon council, the British government and – apparently – some residents of Basildon fail to comprehend.

        And why would I go abroad to ‘some oppressive dictatorship’ to campaign for human rights, when we have a a perfectly tyrannical government here (that was selling arms to dictators last week, in fact: http://www.stoparmingtheworld.org/ ).

        Your status name pretty much summarises the quality of your argument.

      • smoggyjim says:

        Trust me, travellers are huge ambracers of the mindless capitalism you so deplore. They are land owners, they are property owners, it’s self evident and well documented some are very rich and they abuse the enviroment. You can’t deny that can you? But you still support them.

    • Alfie says:

      That says it all. Armchair supporter.

  37. john line says:

    apply for cleud , you may get it and it will give you at least 6 weeks

  38. dave greenwood says:

    kevin when you go out put a hat on cos theres wood peckers out there,

  39. Pingback: Press releases and media advisories | Dale Farm Travellers | WorldWright's …

  40. Pingback: Last minute injunction won! | Dale Farm Travellers | WorldWright's …

  41. Julie Brown says:

    I am suprised Kathleen McCarthy is not issuing more DEATH THREATS that is what she normally does !!!!

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